is this a must play or a wait until you get the shittier pc port in four months game

@shinespark definitely play it. the game is going to be nigh unplayable on pc anyway unless you've got a nasa computer. it maintains a mostly consistent 60fps in combat but hits peaks and valleys during exploration

ok thanks i plan on getting a ps5 soon so i will pick this up

very interesting chandler

>pc port in four months

Does He Know?

another based final fantasy take, at long last. people that hype this up as DMC final fantasy are gonna be super disappointed with the combat but people that actually understand what action games are/can be are in for a fuckin treat here. everyone in this comments section should play Asura’s Wrath

i'm not quite done with the game yet (though i agree with basically everything here) but i'm puzzled/a bit curious why you single out jill as lacking characterization.

again, not done yet (just got titan's powers, if that tells you anything)... but even if she does theoretically end up falling off a bit towards the end (which isn't out of the question, considering what happens to what is arguably final fantasy's most popular heroine) i think the entire thing she has leading up to and especially during the iron kingdom quest is some of the very best stuff in the game. if anything her character finally gives me something i've been yearning for ffxiv to have for years, making it one of many reasons that i find it mind-blowing this game is by most of the same team

i should add in the early game i indubitably agree that she's a bit of a doormat but what we end up learning about her later on recontextualizes it in a bit that i think retroactively makes it work, though i admit considering most of the pre-timeskip phase is a Bit Of A Mess it's wholly likely this was just a happy accident

@straylight i agree that jill initially being a doormat is fine and understandable given her background, but after the events where she confronts her past (which you recently saw) i'd expect her to have more agency in the story going forward. unfortunately, her presence lessens if anything and she pretty much exists to be [the main heroine]

i'm not really someone who typically argues for something being misogynistic or not as i don't feel it's my place to put words in another group's mouth, but jill's lack of presence (and much of what is there just being for clive's sake) strikingly rubbed me the wrong way, which is a shame because i really really like her character in concept. hell - she's a great character, but the writers don't do her justice

Fair criticisms. But you do gotta admit Jill kinda cute.

@celio1 i think jill is a great character on paper. the trouble is she doesn't get to exist very often because the only value the writers see in her is that "she cute"

@chandler I agree with your assessment about Jill - she has interesting motivations, but her role in the story is severely underutilized, and she doesn't really have a personality (so to speak) outside of being a romantic foil for Clive. The other women in the main narrative (especially Benedikta, Vivian, and Mid) felt more complete as characters.

@straylight I was really excited about the Iron Kingdom questline, and I did enjoy a lot of it - but the way it concluded, where Clive had to (once again) save the day, felt disappointing. Jill isn't even the one who destroys the crystal :(

Another issue with Jill is that she appears in so many cutscenes, but has an active role in comparatively few. Her action in the story often comes down to "you go on ahead while I hold them off," and it's frustrating!

@swanwatcher i actually don't think it's an issue that she didn't destroy the crystal because that's clive's mission through and through. she took charge of her personal business in the iron kingdom effectively and i thought her moment there was very, very strong (one of my fav cutscenes in the game). i just thought it was a shame that didn't mark a change in her character going forward

you hit the nail on the head with her being present in most of the game despite her just... not doing anything. that was frustrating

@chandler Agreed that her finally taking revenge was a great moment (and all the more frustrating that her involvement with the narrative drops off almost completely afterwards). And you're right that destroying the crystal is more of Clive's goal than it is Jill's. It was just the way it was framed in the narrative that irked me - she clearly wanted to destroy the crystal herself, but has to (once again) rely on Clive by gifting him her magic. What if Clive had helped her back on her feet and they had destroyed the crystal together, side-by-side? I felt that would have been more romantic and more consistent with who Clive is as a character.

On a related note: as much as I had major problems with XV, it was significantly better with party cohesion/dynamics, whether that be Link Strikes or casual chatter while strolling around. In XVI, party members were essentially mute outside of cutscenes and scripted sequences, which was definitely some ludonarrative dissonance. But I get that corners had to be cut somewhere or else this game would have been in XV's developmental hell.

Also I'm starting to get the itch to write Jill x Clive fanfiction now that I'm thinking about this more :P